true pedigree of the Intelligentsia Venice "Starbucks" GS2

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true pedigree of the Intelligentsia Venice "Starbucks" GS2

Postby Brett Hanson on Wed Apr 29, 2009 10:55 pm

Would anyone be willing to share the origin story for the "Starbucks" Marzocco that's installed at Intelligentsia Venice? I can't quite put my finger on it, but for some reason, reporting inaccuracies like this seem to chafe me.

from http://www.latimes.com/features/food/la ... 0950.story
Coffee geeks will drool over the four-group , the actual machine that powered the first Starbucks at Pike Place Market in 1972. Intelli- gentsia replaced the original panels with wood and glass, so you can see the machine's innards, most of which have been chromed. They added controls that keep water temperature stable to a tenth of a degree.


To my knowledge, Starbucks started espresso service with Faemas and no-one who's performed even a cursory reading of Starbucks history would dispute that espresso service testing started in 1984.

Part of my annoyance might be the "intelly rising from starbucks ashes" bit that is already being circulated through various articles or how this could easily morph into other comparisons http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/French_sur ... _Compiegne :shock:

I've bounced this question to some of the folks involved and received little more than a shrug. It's a cute gambit, but it's also bogus.

Since we can't expect the time-and-cash-strapped media involved to perform due diligence, I think it's incumbent on the folks who are being taken at their word to get the facts straight before sharing them publicly.

Having said all this, I won't pretend that the facts are neatly contained in a folder velcro'd under the machine, but these facts are important... and likely interesting. Anybody still have a contact at ESI?
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Re: true pedigree of the Intelligentsia Venice "Starbucks" GS2

Postby phaelon56 on Thu Apr 30, 2009 4:46 am

I sent you a PM...
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Re: true pedigree of the Intelligentsia Venice "Starbucks" GS2

Postby Marshall on Thu Apr 30, 2009 6:50 am

Brett,

[Edit: my own misreading deleted]
Last edited by Marshall on Thu Apr 30, 2009 7:56 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: true pedigree of the Intelligentsia Venice "Starbucks" GS2

Postby nick on Thu Apr 30, 2009 7:44 am

Marshall, though I'll spare all of us the process of actually diagramming that sentence, gotta say it: you're wrong.

If misreading the sentence that's written makes it more true, so be it. However, what it says there is what it says, and to that, Brett absolutely has a point. Seems though that it's more of a journalistic misprint, a misquote, a misunderstanding, or something like that, rather than an intentional apocryphalism (so to speak) on Intelly's part.
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Re: true pedigree of the Intelligentsia Venice "Starbucks" GS2

Postby Marshall on Thu Apr 30, 2009 7:57 am

nick wrote:Marshall, though I'll spare all of us the process of actually diagramming that sentence, gotta say it: you're wrong.

If misreading the sentence that's written makes it more true, so be it. However, what it says there is what it says, and to that, Brett absolutely has a point. Seems though that it's more of a journalistic misprint, a misquote, a misunderstanding, or something like that, rather than an intentional apocryphalism (so to speak) on Intelly's part.

Nick,

You're right. They should have written "which opened in 1972."
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Re: true pedigree of the Intelligentsia Venice "Starbucks" GS2

Postby Brett Hanson on Thu Apr 30, 2009 10:26 am

Marshall wrote:...They should have written "which opened in 1972."


... or more accurately 1971 (see starbucks history link in original post)

Or (I'll really lay it all out here) the late 1970's when the "original" store was relocated to its current address.

This would also be a good spot to reference Pour Your Heart into It which details how espresso was tested in the 4th or 5th Starbucks store (not the first) before the idea was shot down by the founders and Howard left to start Il Giornale to focus on espresso before the original owners then turned around and sold Starbucks back to him so they could pursue their purchase of Peet's full time. My from-the-hip guess is the original store didn't receive a Marzocco until the early 1990's because it would have needed a renovation to support it and Pike's Market doesn't exactly have a ton of electrical capacity to spare (read "act of god to get more electrical" or "$$$").

It's a misprint/quote that other news outlets have repeated and that Intelly is aware of.

http://www.intelligentsiacoffee.com/about/press <see March 26>
http://topics.blogs.nytimes.com/2009/03 ... esso-past/

I'm not alleging misinformation as much as I'm suggesting laziness.
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Re: true pedigree of the Intelligentsia Venice "Starbucks" GS2

Postby Chris Kornman on Thu Apr 30, 2009 12:15 pm

I know nothing about the history. But I do have a link to some sweet pics of the rebuild for those interested.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/old_timey_dave/sets/72157615805625385/
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Re: true pedigree of the Intelligentsia Venice "Starbucks" GS2

Postby Aaron Ultimo on Thu Apr 30, 2009 7:11 pm

So sick.
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Re: true pedigree of the Intelligentsia Venice "Starbucks" GS2

Postby Doug Zell on Tue May 05, 2009 8:31 pm

So I agree that the information about this machine could certainly have been more clear. I think we honestly believed the original story on it and didn't pursue it vigorously as we didn't give it too much thought given all else that can be swirling around while building out a coffeebar. To set the record straight, I most recently have been told that this machine was in Starbucks' possession, but was most likely used in their entry into, get this, Chicago. To get a more accurate picture, perhaps Terry Z. (the rebuilder and modder) or Kent Bakke (knower of all things espresso) will chime in here to provide a more clear view. That's it. We apologize for the confusion.

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Re: true pedigree of the Intelligentsia Venice "Starbucks" GS2

Postby paul_pratt on Thu May 07, 2009 8:35 pm

John B. would give you the history on that machine I believe.

Terry and I talked about this before, other than the history the rarity is the fact that it is a 4 group. They don't turn up very often. I think there is another 4 group in use in Seattle.

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Re: true pedigree of the Intelligentsia Venice "Starbucks" GS2

Postby geir oglend on Fri May 08, 2009 4:05 am

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Re: true pedigree of the Intelligentsia Venice "Starbucks" GS2

Postby phaelon56 on Fri May 08, 2009 8:28 am

John B clears up all the confusion completely:

In short this machine was first sold to Starbucks for the opening of their very first Chicago store. It was decommissioned by Starbucks and sent to their restoration facility in Seattle, no one there had ever seen one so it was set aside, they were rebuilding the Linea at the time. It was headed for the metal scrap bin when it was rescued by me. I have had it in my pile for low all these many years until Terry Z was looking around for something special to do up for Doug Z and the new bar in Venice beach.
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Re: true pedigree of the Intelligentsia Venice "Starbucks" GS2

Postby nick on Fri May 08, 2009 10:11 am

Then I'm confused by Mr. Nicely's comment on his recent photo of this lovely machine on his Flickr page:

Image
"7 Years after I filled shifts and pulled shots on this the original 1972 GS2 Lamarzocco of Pike Place Market Starbucks, I got to welcome it with my new family! "
http://www.flickr.com/photos/naturallya ... 204720288/

Not trying to call anyone out... just curious and puzzled.
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Re: true pedigree of the Intelligentsia Venice "Starbucks" GS2

Postby Brett Hanson on Fri May 08, 2009 2:19 pm

nick wrote:Then I'm confused by Mr. Nicely's comment...


I'm all for holding to account the company employees who have been interviewed, failed to correct the mistakes in the articles, and posted them on the company web site for public viewing, but Nicely Nice is damn near above reproach in my book, so I have to chalk this up to either him trusting the folks spreading the information or him thinking that the GS2 was actually the linea that he used to work with seven years ago at Pikes Place Market (just modded by terryz to include paddle groups and be all purdy).

While it would be more interesting if something truly nefarious was going on, the consistency of the innacuracy leads my thinking more towards Hanlon's razor.
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Re: true pedigree of the Intelligentsia Venice "Starbucks" GS2

Postby Brett Hanson on Tue Feb 16, 2010 4:44 pm

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Re: true pedigree of the Intelligentsia Venice "Starbucks" GS2

Postby Marshall on Tue Feb 16, 2010 5:06 pm

Brett Hanson wrote:It's baaaAAAAaaaCK.

http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/dailydi ... anned.html

I'm sure it's in the Times's photo archive, tagged for "intelligentsia" and always to be shown with that label.
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Re: true pedigree of the Intelligentsia Venice "Starbucks" GS2

Postby Brett Hanson on Wed Feb 17, 2010 12:11 am

Marshall wrote:
Brett Hanson wrote:It's baaaAAAAaaaCK.

http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/dailydi ... anned.html

I'm sure it's in the Times's photo archive, tagged for "intelligentsia" and always to be shown with that label.


Yes and no. http://www.latimes.com/features/food/la ... 0950.story

It's unfortunate in the decades of print journalism that newspapers have never:

(a) developed a way to print a correction, or
(b) found anyone at intelly who can confirm or deny the details of a story.

:wink:
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Re: true pedigree of the Intelligentsia Venice "Starbucks" GS2

Postby Brett Hanson on Tue Apr 27, 2010 11:56 am

A new feature about the 1987 (per John B) GS2 and cappuccinos.
http://vimeo.com/11249580

More info about Starbucks entry into Chicago in 1987 and the blend they created to celebrate it.
http://www.starbucks.com/coffee/whole-b ... oast-blend
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