GS3 steaming capabilities

[scottlucey]

Is it just me or does the steaming capabilities of a GS3 leave a bit to be desired? My experience isn't that vast, but I have not been impressed w steaming power.
Is this common?
Are GS3 owners modifying their wands or boilers to improve this?
Suggestions?

Other than that I still love the GS3. Let's make that clear.

[phaelon56]

Are you comparing it to E61 style prosumer machines or to multi-group larger commercial machines? And what volume of milk are you steaming?

Ive only played with a GS3 once - just for a few hours when Andy S had a beta model to evaluate. I was trying to steam about 4 oz of milk and found it to be way too fast/powerful to easily achieve good microfoam for that volume. I am under the impression that people are using a few different tips to get better results. IIRC Andy plugged up one of the tip holes with a small piece of toothpick and saw significant improvement in steaming performance.

Also - not totally relevant but worth discussing - the "no burn" wands tend to accumulate a lot of water internally and need to be purged for longer than traditional wands before actually immersing them in milk.

[James Hoffmann]

I always had trouble with the no-burn wand on it. The prototypes I used after getting my GS3 all steamed better but had traditional wands. You can upgrade/downgrade the no-burn wand to a normal style one with improved results but I don't use my GS3 often enough to warrant the expense.

[phaelon56]

I always had trouble with the no-burn wand on it. The prototypes I used after getting my GS3 all steamed better but had traditional wands. You can upgrade/downgrade the no-burn wand to a normal style one with improved results but I don't use my GS3 often enough to warrant the expense.

I should have mentioned... I don't care for no-burn wands and don't quite see the point. I have never burned myself on a steam wand and see the likelihood of doing so as very low.

[Chris Kornman]

Have had some luck steaming with the GS3, but it's certainly nothing compared to the great wands on the Synessos & Marzoccos in the cafes. These were our best results last time we tried to make some latte art. (http://roasters.wordpress.com/2009/05/15/roaster-larte/)

[Andy Schecter]

Is it just me or does the steaming capabilities of a GS3 leave a bit to be desired?

Hey Scott, forgive me for asking an obvious question, but didja try turning up the steam boiler temp setting? Higher temp = higher pressure = more steam....

[russprefontaine]

I just read an interesting article about this on the Slayer Espresso web site. I personally found it very informative: http://www.slayerespresso.com/2009/10/1 ... /#more-801

[Andy Schecter]

I just read an interesting article about this on the Slayer Espresso web

Russ, that isn't an "interesting article," it's an advertisement.

Besides which, it has nothing to do with the topic (the steaming performance of a portable, 115 volt, 20 amp espresso machine)....

[Robert Goble]

I just read an interesting article about this on the Slayer Espresso web site. I personally found it very informative: http://www.slayerespresso.com/2009/10/1 ... /#more-801

Some disclosure might be in order here as well Russ -- Could you clarify the Prefontaine Brother/Fratello relationship as owners/investors in Slayer?

[Eric Perkunder]

For what its worth, my article did not literally reference the GS/3. However, the topic of steam capability is still relevant. What some are experiencing on their small home machines, many commercial users also experience. Part of this issue may be due to insulated steam wands, but I also think it has to do with how water is pre-heated for brewing--as explained in my "advertisement".
As far as the contention that what I have written is an "advertisement" I suppose it could be interpreted in the very narrowest sense as being so, since it is posted on the Slayer blog, and the Slayer machine avoids this pitfall. However, I think the smug dismissal of someone's effort to help inform the market, regardless of their affiliation as "advertising" shows a lack of curiosity and, I fear, some possibly negative motives.
I hope we can try and keep this form focussed on enlightening those interested in advancing the craft and keep our ridiculous politics out of it.

[James Hoffmann]

The issues with the GS3's steaming capacity, as I understand it, with the earlier production models were more to do with the route from steam boiler to wand rather than a lack of steam produced. Apparently replacing the tube from the steam boiler and wand fixes this.

[Marshall]

However, I think the smug dismissal of someone's effort to help inform the market, regardless of their affiliation as "advertising" shows a lack of curiosity and, I fear, some possibly negative motives.
I hope we can try and keep this form focussed on enlightening those interested in advancing the craft and keep our ridiculous politics out of it.

Since the subject came up, people should be aware of the new U.S. Federal Trade Commission rules that were issued two weeks ago (effective Dec. 2009). They basically ban several forms of stealth advertising on web forums.

Andy may have been thinking of this rule in particular:

Example 8: An online message board designated for discussions of new music download technology is frequented by MP3 player enthusiasts. They exchange information about new products, utilities, and the functionality of numerous playback devices. Unbeknownst to the message board community, an employee of a leading playback device manufacturer has been posting messages on the discussion board promoting the manufacturer’s product. Knowledge of this poster’s employment likely would affect the weight or credibility of her endorsement. Therefore, the poster should clearly and conspicuously disclose her relationship to the manufacturer to members and readers of the message board.

http://www.ftc.gov/os/2009/10/091005endorsementguidesfnnotice.pdf

I'm not saying the post would necessarily be a violation. But, everyone needs to exercise a little more caution on the web now, if they are marketing products to U.S. customers.

[Andy Schecter]

I think the smug dismissal of someone's effort to help inform the market, regardless of their affiliation as "advertising" shows a lack of curiosity and, I fear, some possibly negative motives.
I hope we can try and keep this form focussed on enlightening those interested in advancing the craft and keep our ridiculous politics out of it.

Hi Eric:

You're right, I did have a negative motive: calling Russ out on his oh-so-lame "guerilla marketing" approach. If you feel my doing that is "ridiculous politics," we surely disagree. And I believe our craft is better advanced when, among other things, people are upfront about their business relationships.

BTW, I love your coffee-related pics on Flickr. Some dramatic and fun stuff there.

I hear the Slayer machine is pretty good, too.

[russprefontaine]

Robert & Andy, you have asked for some disclosure with my involvement in Slayer. Yes, I am an investor, but out side of this have nothing to do with the company. I am not a creator, builder or marketer for the company. I do not "approve" blog posting on the Slayer site before they are written, so when they appear on a site, it is always my first time reading them.

This being said I do find Eric to be very informative in what he writes on this site. I put this link on this post as it was relating to steam pressure, and found it interesting. I am not a "promoter" of Slayer on this site, and as you will see, this was my first time bringing anything up about Slayer. Eric and Slayer do not need my "Gorilla Marketing help".

[nick]

Robert & Andy, you have asked for some disclosure with my involvement in Slayer. Yes, I am an investor, but out side of this have nothing to do with the company.

Just a friendly note: You've gotta understand, Russ, how ridiculous this reads.

[terry]

alt.coffeed

[Jason Haeger]

I did some training for a home user a few months ago on his GS/3.

Adjusting the pressure (read: temp) was enough to dial it well enough for the task. The bulk of the adjustment was technique refinement more than machine fiddling.

Pouring art was not a problem.

[Michael Phillips]

James is spot on about early GS3s and the tube from the wand to the boiler. They for some reason thought plastic was a good idea but were sadly mistaken. This was changed in later models. Even with newer ones however I have not been impressed with the steaming even after playing with the boiler temp. I have done demos with GS3s and I have done demos with home machines like the Andreja premium, and in all honestly the Andreja performed wonderfully in comparison (I went into it very biased against the Andreja as well)